I'm passing this question along from a fellow who asked it in the HEX forums; it seems he had trouble trying to get in here.

To quote:

Can you heal Burn with magic?

I'm assuming he means using magical healing to remove Burn damage (as opposed to using extra successes in the magic roll to reduce Burn, which is already covered).

The core rulebook says:


That's pretty clear, I think.

I don't think it's quite that clear. The section of the rules that says that (page 187) is talking about using skills to heal injuries. So yes, clearly you can't heal burn with Medicine. However, I don't think that you can immediately and obviously infer that you cannot heal burn with magic. It seems very in flavor to me for a necromancer to suck the life-force out of someone and use it to heal his burn. There are a lot of restrictions on magical healing, and it seems to me that it should be able to heal burn, but maybe I'm totally wrong here.

I take it as Burn damage affects your soul, not your life-force. Only large amounts of Burn can kill someone, but it takes a lot (Burn -> Nonlethal -> Lethal). I have always gone with the core book on the subject: only time can heal Burn. It also heals really fast so unless there's an immediately dangerous situation (which is very likely, given the setting) you can always just wait it out, which also allows non-magical healing to be handled in the meantime.

And on page 133 when it's about magical healing it says:


So I think it is quite that clear. If Burn could be healed it would be written there, I think. And for my part, I never allowed my players to heal Burn via magic.

Just playing Devil's Advocate, but on page 135, it says "Burn damage is a type of non-lethal damage deducted from the caster’s Health." So, the quote on page 133 could be construed to include Burn damage as it is counted as non-lethal. Then again, the section on Damage seems pretty explicit in separating Damage into the three types (lethal, non-lethal and Burn).

I certainly agree that mundane medical skills cannot heal Burn damage. I also noticed that the Quick Healer Talent does not speed up the rate of Burn damage healing, either.

Until we get an official answer, I'm leaning towards Gilgamesh's viewpoint with a strong dash of "GM's discretion" as an answer.

Thanks for the input, guys!

Hi guys,
I thing it's so clear too, the corebook is very especific in that case.

Therefore, in my point of view, only burn can be healed with rest, as Gilga says.

See you

Hullo, Nestor,



I think the game system is pretty clear on this, to be honest. Burn damage is caused by the damage done to the caster of a spell through the use of magic and the manner in which the use of magic affects the caster. Hence, the Burn damage is actually magical in nature as well. Thus, for that reason alone, I would argue that Magic cannot be used to heal Burn. Add to that the rulebook cleary stating that *time* is what heals Burn, and the relatively quick rate at which Burn heals (1 point per half hour). Also bear in mind that there are only two types of magic that can heal damage and the like to begin with, so...

Hope this helps.

I'm prepared to be totally wrong on this, but it just seems obvious to me that that section of the book is talking about mundane healing, not magic. Further, exactly as Nestor pointed out, Burn is explicitly described as a type of non-lethal damage, and magic is explicitly described as healing "lethal or non-lethal damage."

I think this is my basic argument: The necromancer spell "syphon life" is a terrible spell if you can't heal burn. It's a damaging spell that requires 4 success. You could instead cast the 2 success version, and if you get 4 successes use those extra successes to get the same damage, or to prevent burn to yourself. You can only heal non-burn damage to yourself, which you can do with a much lower threshold spell (thus a higher chance of success and lower chance of taking burn). The only advantage you get is combining those two actions into one, which is pretty slim for the massive hit in effectiveness you get. For a 4 success spell, you're going to take as much burn as you heal, most of the time.

Hullo, Ulfendar,



While you make a valid point above, why heal a type of damage (Burn damage) that starts to heal within a half hour of taking it? However, more to the point, Burn is described in the chapter on Magic (DESOLATION page 135, first column, under "Calculate Burn", as mentally and physically draining, causing discomfort and fatigue to the caster. Furthermore, whie it does state that Burn is a type of non-lethal damage, as a general rule, non-lethal damage of 4 points would be tracked as 4N, but 2 points of Burn damage would be listed as 2B. Look at the chapter on Combat, page 184, first column, the first line under "Damage", where it says there are three types of damage. The second column, right above the "Effects of Damage", talks more about Burn as well, indicating that it is strain, exhaustion, and pain, not "true damage" per se. Also read the section on "Magical Healing", page 187, first column. However, the best indicator of why magic should not be used to heal Burn is found in the Healing Example chart in the Magic Chapter, page 133, second column. Of all the sample effects listed, healing Burn is not listed there. How's that for a convincing argument?



Here's the problem I've got with that way of thinking. Magic in DESOLATION in the After is dangerous, unpredictable, and is not something that most casters tend to brag about in the After because of the largely present poor attitude towards it. One of the central aspects of magic in the After, regardless of Tradition, is that any spell that a caster uses has a chance of being disastrous (i.e., rolling lots of Burn damage and failures), but that even the low end spells (i.e., those with a Difficulty of 1) can cause Burn, even if you choose to roll one die rather than three. The second key aspect to remember is that spell effects are increased by extra successes above the Difficulty. Thus, a character who wants to do more damage with an offensive spell needs to gamble and roll extra dice above the basic number required for the Difficulty, and will possibly take more Burn damage. The Burn is part of the nature of magic in the After. What this means to me, anyway, is that when one casts a higher Difficulty spell to begin with, one has to be willing to pay the cost. And the cost is much higher in the After than it ever was in the Before.

Btw, Siphon Life doesn't have a 2 success version, it's a Difficulty 4 spell, which means that you have to have a minimum of 4 successes for the spell to work properly. And with something like that spell, you definitely want it to work properly. Then again, the higher the Difficulty of the spell, the harder and more taxing the spell is for the caster to work, and that's the way it should be.

My $0.02, of course.

I think he means the damage spell only cost 2, so for 4 you should be getting something extra.

Hullo, Morton,



Could be. I assumed from the way the post was written that he meant using a lower level version of the spell in terms of the damage.

Hi, guys,

If you want to house rule that magical healing can repair Burn damage, you could insist that the healer has to deal with the Burn first, then heal any remaining "regular" wounds. That way you are exposing the healer to more Burn, too. That's always fun.

The rules, as written, are definitely intended to showcase the brutal risks that casters take in the After. If you're feeling like they're too harsh, then we've made them just harsh enough

Stephen

Hullo, Stephen,

It's alive! It's alive!!!!!



Ooh, I hadn't considered doing it that way to be honest, but I rather like that idea. The healer getting Burn for trying to magically heal Burn is so poetical justice and all that.



Hey, works for me! I actually never found the rules on this to be too harsh, just very fitting of the style of game that is portrayed in Desolation. Harsh in the After is good.