Hullo, folks,

Got a question for everyone...

Why is it that DESOLATION gets no love anywhere?

For example, on RPG.net, the two threads there (one of which I started) seemed to highlight the belief on everyone's part that the game had an interesting premise, but that the setting was bland for a fantasy setting.

How do folks feel about the setting and all, in that regard? And what counter would you make to that claim?

Why else do folks think that DESOLATION gets no love?

That's a hard question to answer since it's based on perception.

Personally, I don't ascribe to the theory that RPG.net represents the interests or attitudes of the gaming community as a whole, so its lack of support for Desolation doesn't really bother me much.

Desolation, like its cousin game HEX, is a niche game. By definition it is not going to garner broad appeal across the spectrum, and, IMO, shouldn't be judged by that standard. Just like HEX, its appeal becomes evident from word-of-mouth and personal experience, so it's going to take a while for it to grow.

The population of Desolation fans may be small, but I believe it is growing and will continue to do so steadily, as long as we continue to play it and show other people around us how much fun it can be.

Hullo, Nestor,



I am pretty much of the same opinion you are in regards to RPG.net and all, but have to say that a lot of people go there and read reviews and forum threads about games, and that certainly influences the casual gamer who might pick up DESOLATION on a whim. In regards to both DESOLATION and HEX, those folks who've responded there to the criticisms of the games either get their heads lopped off (metaphorically) or end up spending time defending the game and its stance. That may or may not endear the game to potential buyers. But as you said, it's definitely a matter of perception.

While everyone that looks at the game seems to like the Magic system (and sometimes I wish that HEX would just go over to this style of Magic system, you know!), the main complaint seem seems to be the "blandness" of the setting. This really bugs me, as I just don't understand where that's coming from, given the weird shite that one can find in the After, the beasties in the world, the neat twists to the standard fantasy races, and the like.



From your mouth to the Goddess's ears, mate!

Goddess knows that I've been playing it, running it, hyping it, and all. I've sold a few copies of the game in the store where I run the demos (believe it or not, the main gaming store in Ottawa doesn't do rpg demos since a very bad incident occurred at one time). The folks who've played the games I've run at CanGames ("Shadow of the Wolf" most recently, which went off really well both times I ran it; you remember my reviews of it here?) loved the game, got into the world setting and the feel of their characters (that pesky elf Menelaris! ), and liked the simplicity of the game mechanics. But for all of that, there don't seem to be a lot of folks running/playing the game, and the forum population here hasn't grown all that much the last year since GenCon 2008. Here's hoping this year's GenCon brings a flock of new people into the game.

I know that this thread is a tad old, but I wanted to throw in my opinion on both of these questions. Right off the bat, I would like to say that I was initially intrigued when I first heard about Desolation. I found the idea of doing a genre fusion of Fantasy / Post-Apocalyptic to be extremely fascinating, so much so that I hounded my local game store to make sure that they ordered me a copy as soon as it was released.

When it finally came in, I was not disappointed. Even though I was not familiar with the Ubiquity System, I could see how the system was a good fit for the game, and I was thrilled to see an open magic system as well (side note, I was a very big fan of Mage: The Ascension). I enjoyed the twists on the standard fantasy races, and felt that the overall world setting was well thought out.

In the end, I have to say that I have not been disappointed with Desolation, and that I am looking forward to picking up the Survivors book soon.



I think that some people may be a bit harder on the game because most have only seen the core book, and they may have felt that there was not enough detail in the setting, and they do not understand that the core book is really an overview of the world before and that the setting is now one of discovery. I believe that the Survivors book is going to help give more flavor to the setting, and help to get more people on board with the line.

In the end, I hope this line keeps going, and that I will continue to support the line.....and spread the word on this fantastic game.

From the Void,

Forrest

Welcome aboard, sir! Glad to have you join us!

Yes, a big draw of the game for me was the interesting mash-up of genres. I've mentioned this before, but I'm generally not a fan of fantasy RPGs, mainly because too many of them just seem to fall into the same "fight the monsters, grab the loot" mentality of the field's first and foremost representative.

While I admit, as a fan of the Ubiquity system I was bound to be interested in the game, it was the whole "this is not your daddy's D&D" paradigm that it brings out what got me to stay.

In any case, take a look around, make yourself at home, heck, let us know how things go. We're a friendly bunch around here. Just watch out for that JohnK fellow; I hear he hangs out with elves.

Hullo, Prophet 23,

Welcome aboard the DESOLATION forums! I have no idea how I missed this post, but thank Goddess Nestor posted a reply here and brought my attention to this thread again!

You make some excellent points in your feelings about the setting, and I'm glad to hear that you've not been disappointed with the setting and the game as a whole. For me, one of the highlights of the game is the free-form magic system, but when coupled with the Ubiquity system, I really like all aspects of the game.

Just want to address your point below...



This is an excellent point, and certainly an interesting one. The amount of detail in the main DESOLATION book on the Before is adequate to run a game in the Before if that is what one wants, and I really believe that setting the game mere months after the Night of Fire was an interesting spin to the post-apocalypse feel of the game. Making the maps of the Before relatively useless to the players and GM alike was a really good move, since it mean that the game world is a tabula rasa in some ways for how GMs want to envision their post-apocalypse Scondera. Some gamers will appreciate this, but I suspect many who prefer their settings fully defined for them won't.



Same here.

Hullo, Nestor,



Interesting points, Nestor. While I can't say the "mash-up" of genres appeals to me so much, what I like about DESOLATION is the fact that while the game is post-apocalyptic, it still has the feel of a fantasy game, and that it's *not* about fighting the monsters, looting their corpses, and repeat and rinse. For me, that mentality in fantasy gaming has bothered me for some time and I've outgrown that style of gaming. One of the reasons The Dying Earth rpg still appeals to me so much these days, I suppose.



Hey, I resent that remark!! I spit on elves with the best of them, twice on days when I can muster up that much spit!

And that's pretty much my point too; sorry if I didn't make it clear. Desolation's appeal to me stems from the fact that it is a fantasy RPG that doesn't follow the old hackneyed paradigm. I'm right there with you, sir; I left that attitude way back in college and never looked back.



Glad to hear it. We'll be getting together later for a game of Kick-The-Burned-Out-Spellcaster. Wanna join in?

Hullo, Nestor,



Sums it up for me quite well. Wasn't so much the hack 'n slash paradigm for me, although that bothered me as I got into my '30s (bearing in mind that I was already into my 20s when D&D came out), so much as the level system and the other stuff I mentioned.

And we're not gonna go into the subject of how long either of us has been out of college!



Sure thing! After that, can we play a game of Feed-Garbage-to-the-Island Folk, or Pour-Garbage-Over-the-Island-Folk? I much prefer the latter to the former, because one doesn't have to get as close to them that way, but your preference is good!

What I like about it (before actually having played anything, mind) is that it is Fantasy and it is gritty Fantasy. Generally, I create wizard characters and while I was never really satisfied with the concept of "mana" as a depreciable (sp?) value that replenished over time, and I absolutely HATED the cast the spell once a day and then memorize it again, I really like the fact that Desolation is free-form magic (as it should be!!!) and that because of the Apocalypse, magic hurts!

I can see why a lot of much younger players who are more interested in wish-fulfillment and power-crazed wankery would be put off by it because it is essentially about survival and not kill-this-monster-and-steal-his-loot-for-xp. It requires a certain leap in imagination, both as a magic user and as a player within the world. The idea that a purely peasant-level craftsman could be more valuable (socially, economically, etc.) that the big burly bastard with that nifty sword is something a lot of... less mature (?) players may not be able to wrap their heads around.

That is my arrogant, condescending $0.02 worth.

Hullo, 18Puppies,



One thing I have to say here is that Desolation isn't necessarily gritty fantasy, in that the Ubiquity game system is one that it quite cinematic. Yes, there are ways to make the system more gritty and down-to-earth, but this particular Ubiquity variant isn't necessarily that. Others may disagree with me, of course.

As for magic, my favourite style of magic is probably that found in the Jack Vance Dying Earth novels (on which the D&D system magic was based) and the magic system found in the old SPI DRAGONQUEST fantasy rpg system, where magic was divided by Colleges. That said, the magic system in Desolation is one of the best I've seen around (and I wish that HEX and ALL FOR ONE had a variant of this system), but players either love it or hate it.



LOL! Any post-apocalyptic rpg that is set so close to the aftermath of the apocalypse itself is bound to be more about survival and social elements of survival in such a world, unlike most non-apocalyptic rpgs. Playing in the post-Night of Fire world of Scondera is quite different and unique, and makes for an interesting challenge for players and GMs alike. That's my take on things.

People I have talked with that own and read the game tend to file it under things that they would like to play if they had the time. I get the impression it actually gets a lot of love, just very little attention, and this is sad.


I think the setting has a tremendous amount going for it, and definitely see the broad strokes and outlines presented for what is 'out there' to be a huge asset for both solidly defined plotting styles and for off-the-cuff plotting styles. The flexibility and instant usability of Desolation with just the Core Book is a fantastic mirror for Ubiquity itself. As I mentioned in my review of the game and system, both are fantastic for stimulating creativity, and then getting out of your way. I just can't get enough of it.

Hullo, Runeslinger,



I don't know whether that's the case, Runeslinger, but there's very few places on the internet that the game gets good press, and a lot of folks seem to denigrate the game world as being too generic, among other things, in places where the game gets mentioned at all (other than here on the forums, and on my blog, among a few others that I know of). That said, I know the game is quite popular at CanGames here in Ottawa, as I have to turn away people at the convention gaming tables.



No argument here.

Its the under-appreciated cute girl that blooms into a beautiful woman and boom! In a few years time suddenly everyone realizes they 've been moronic...

And by then shes off with some of dudes that understood/appreciated her in the first place

That's us btw so yeah..

On the other hand my argument also makes the game kind of slutty-sharing all the fans etc- but hey..sshht!